User
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
February 08, 2010, 11:09:12 PM

Login with username, password and session length
  Search
  Stats
84270 Posts in 3266 Topics by 11367 Members
Latest Member: Leftnut
  News
Pages: [1] 2 3
Print
Author Topic: (QOTW 08252008) Defense, Looting, Insurance  (Read 6135 times)
Moll
Community Manager
Administrator
*****
Posts: 1025


Organizing Enterra for a better tomorrow.


View Profile
« on: August 24, 2008, 11:27:07 PM »

Hello!
Happy Monday, everyone. This week as our team is returning from the Leipzig Games Convention, we take some time out to revisit an old and favorite topic with a new twist - defense and looting.


Tyrus Dark asks us one very interesting question regarding defenders - are they in fact too powerful to handle by any offensive attack? We say "certainly not!"

1) What's to prevent the defender's respawn point within their base (or teleport point) (as noted by the recent Stratics Chat) from giving a defender a nearly-overwhelming advantage: assuming roughly equal economic strength, it seems like 1 kill for the defenders will mean a LOT more than one kill for the attackers.

When a player is killed, all his inventory that is not Insured is dropped on the battlefield and before his next respawn he is offered a chance to reinsure all his inventory and to retrieve items that were dropped but not yet looted at excessive price if he definitely does not want something lost. Given the death rate on a battlefield, expect defenders to lose huge amount of money by constantly being respawned and their inventory reinsured. Despite this, there is an option to actually make money in a siege battle if you score more kills than deaths, at some point the defenders will deplete their personal funds forcing many of their members to retreat or face being totally looted... and returning to the battlefield completely naked is an embarrassment most players will want to avoid at all cost, not to mention they won't be able to offer any realistic defense of their base.


Please be sure to visit our other related topics:
http://forums.play-earthrise.com/index.php?topic=1521.0 (insurance, as it relates to looting)
http://forums.play-earthrise.com/index.php?topic=1158.0 (insurance)
http://forums.play-earthrise.com/index.php?topic=23.0 (21 pages of looting fun)

See you all on the forums, and thank you to the developers for this clarification! As always, we invite discussion on this topic, below.
- m.


Logged
Viptir
Honorary Citizen
****
Posts: 335



View Profile
« Reply #1 on: August 24, 2008, 11:47:06 PM »

Quote
and returning to the battlefield completely naked is an embarrassment most players will want to avoid at all cost

embarrassment to whom? /streaks

Also, that bit about personal funds; won't these guilds also have their own monetary coffers that the defenders would be able to draw upon?
Logged

"Live as Brave Men..." ~Cicero
Rift
Honorary Citizen
****
Posts: 407


The Assassins Guild.


View Profile WWW
« Reply #2 on: August 24, 2008, 11:59:25 PM »

But the attacking side are also susceptible to item loss and insurance premiums... am i missing something?  Huh

My answer to Tyrus would be the guild defending the base are supposed to have a huge advantage, that's why they have spent all the time and funds fortifying their position. In any military campaign attacking a defensive stronghold of an enemy will always consume a vast number of resources.

To quote one of the greatest military strategists who ever lived;

Quote
Siege warfare is a last resort.

In a siege, Three months are needed to assemble protective shields, armoured wagons, sundry, siege weapons and equipment.

Another three months to pile earthern ramps. - Sun Tzu

Guild bases are not supposed to change hands like erm... biscuits. (I'm hungry)  Roll Eyes
Logged

"It Is Better To Reign In Hell Than To Serve In Heaven" - John Milton, Paradise Lost

-The Assassins Guild
Devildog1
Model Citizen
***
Posts: 230


I'm here for the beer! Have you seen my pants?!


View Profile
« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2008, 12:11:53 AM »

But the attacking side are also susceptible to item loss and insurance premiums... am i missing something?  Huh

My answer to Tyrus would be the guild defending the base are supposed to have a huge advantage, that's why they have spent all the time and funds fortifying their position. In any military campaign attacking a defensive stronghold of an enemy will always consume a vast number of resources.

To quote one of the greatest military strategists who ever lived;

Guild bases are not supposed to change hands like erm... biscuits. (I'm hungry)  Roll Eyes

Gotta agree with Rift here! If you wanna take a fortified position it should cost you if not then why take any sort of land?
Logged
Joker
Hero of Sal Vitas
*****
Posts: 848


Errrr.....


View Profile
« Reply #4 on: August 25, 2008, 03:11:03 AM »

I doubt they will tap into there guild coffers to defend a base as that would leave them even more vulnerable.  The cost of losing a base is the deduction of incoming money from a certain resource  and if your base is lost than there is  the grievance of putting all that money into structures and what not to make the base better and more defensible.
Logged

Viptir
Honorary Citizen
****
Posts: 335



View Profile
« Reply #5 on: August 25, 2008, 03:43:22 AM »

Keeping the defenders equipped insured/equipped may be cheaper, in the long run, than losing a base and all its upgrades, though.
Logged

"Live as Brave Men..." ~Cicero
Setesh
Model Citizen
***
Posts: 173



View Profile WWW
« Reply #6 on: August 25, 2008, 11:25:32 AM »

It sounds a lot better than a bunch of bored folks in a city getting together at some random moment to "go cap some bases". 
Logged

What was done to me created me.  Its a basic principle of the universe. 

Cavadus
Hero of Sal Vitas
*****
Posts: 1522


"Service Above Self"


View Profile WWW
« Reply #7 on: August 25, 2008, 12:27:35 PM »

I don't understand the point of this QOTW.  Everything mentioned is just as, if not more, applicable to attackers, is it not?
Logged

CursedSeishi
Hero of Sal Vitas
*****
Posts: 784


Prone to using various Tick-isms.


View Profile
« Reply #8 on: August 25, 2008, 12:45:06 PM »

I don't understand the point of this QOTW.  Everything mentioned is just as, if not more, applicable to attackers, is it not?

I have to agree, the way I read it, the effects listed affect both parties involved. I'm sure the attackers will have saved up more in anticipation of the attack, but so will the defenders I'd assume. You take into consideration the defensive structures the base might have, and the attackers have it worse off the way I see it. So it still seems to stack in favor of the defense.

Unless the offensive party pays less than the defensive for getting back items and insuring them during siege, it still favors the defense. I do understand that the taking of a base is a great undertaking though, and I am hoping that I am missing something lol
Logged



~who needs guns when you wield a giant nerf bat?~
Beware! Thy curse shall draw thou off topiceth!
Rift
Honorary Citizen
****
Posts: 407


The Assassins Guild.


View Profile WWW
« Reply #9 on: August 25, 2008, 12:58:28 PM »

I don't understand the point of this QOTW.  Everything mentioned is just as, if not more, applicable to attackers, is it not?

Yep, lol.

That's a good thing though, taking a fortified position should be difficult.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2008, 01:02:59 PM by Rift » Logged

"It Is Better To Reign In Hell Than To Serve In Heaven" - John Milton, Paradise Lost

-The Assassins Guild
Joker
Hero of Sal Vitas
*****
Posts: 848


Errrr.....


View Profile
« Reply #10 on: August 25, 2008, 01:32:56 PM »

I don't understand the point of this QOTW.  Everything mentioned is just as, if not more, applicable to attackers, is it not?

I think that is the whole point.  I think what they are trying to say that it is going to be balanced and just cause you are defending does not mean you get extra bonuses besides defensive structures and the respawn point. 
Logged

Xyleya
Hero of Sal Vitas
*****
Posts: 2745


serial killer


View Profile
« Reply #11 on: August 25, 2008, 02:03:37 PM »

1. you don't equip your best gear during sieges
2. this cheap equipment does not get ensured
3. the defender can teleport into the base
4. the defender can reequip in the base
5. the attacker needs to travel
6. the attacker suffers also losses

This leaves us with the situation, that the defender has way too much advantages here.

And last but not least:

7. IF the defender wins the battle, he can loot all the gear having no losses at all in the end!



Logged



Shooting you in the face.
Setesh
Model Citizen
***
Posts: 173



View Profile WWW
« Reply #12 on: August 25, 2008, 02:28:15 PM »

So don't plan on treating ER's PVP as a kill/die fest.  The guys that rush in against a well defended base are gonna die, pay dearly for it.  Looks like this is encouraging tactics over zerg mentality. 

I realize a lot of the pvp'ers are going to say "but we want our freedom to pvp any way we want!"  However as always, there has to be a balance. 

Logged

What was done to me created me.  Its a basic principle of the universe. 

CursedSeishi
Hero of Sal Vitas
*****
Posts: 784


Prone to using various Tick-isms.


View Profile
« Reply #13 on: August 25, 2008, 03:06:56 PM »

I think that is the whole point.  I think what they are trying to say that it is going to be balanced and just cause you are defending does not mean you get extra bonuses besides defensive structures and the respawn point. 
So don't plan on treating ER's PVP as a kill/die fest.  The guys that rush in against a well defended base are gonna die, pay dearly for it.  Looks like this is encouraging tactics over zerg mentality. 

Mmm true, I think I was trying too hard to see how the offense is favored instead of the defense, that I did overlook those points.
Yet I am still a little worried though about how the offense fairs against a fortified base. Hard to tell though until beta starts and we can actually try it out lol
So I'll just take some cautious optimism to this.

And there aint nothing wrong with a good ol fashion zerg, as long as its timed right, or there is an ungodly number of the attackers present and all are at least adequately geared and skilled lol
Logged



~who needs guns when you wield a giant nerf bat?~
Beware! Thy curse shall draw thou off topiceth!
Joker
Hero of Sal Vitas
*****
Posts: 848


Errrr.....


View Profile
« Reply #14 on: August 25, 2008, 04:19:06 PM »

1. you don't equip your best gear during sieges
2. this cheap equipment does not get ensured
3. the defender can teleport into the base
4. the defender can reequip in the base
5. the attacker needs to travel
6. the attacker suffers also losses

This leaves us with the situation, that the defender has way too much advantages here.

And last but not least:

7. IF the defender wins the battle, he can loot all the gear having no losses at all in the end!

The defenders will have a major money loss from gear, insurance and also repairs to building/defensive structures.
We do not know such things as they can teleport into there bases.  I have not read that what I read about teleports is that they will be like eve that they will not go to certain destinations just certain locations.   I have no clue where you are pulling this kinda information out of.  The only thing they have is respawn and defensive structures.  Other than that it is all gear and skills.   

Also what you expect...Isn't that the whole point of attacking a base taking a risk? Like Rift said taking a fortified position should be difficult. 

I really do not see a problem with the current way they are making it. 
« Last Edit: August 25, 2008, 04:36:43 PM by Joker » Logged

Pages: [1] 2 3
Print
Jump to:  

Powered by SMF 1.1.11 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC
Masthead Studios